Comments on: Full day kindergarten: Yes? No? Maybe?

By: Evelyn

Evelyn — Wed, 22 Sep 2010 21:54:27 +0000

Great articles and valid points and suggestions. I too live in Ontario, near Ottawa and my monthly daycare fees for two children for the month of August was $1672. I took extra leave after my mat leave to be at home longer with my small children. But life being what it is, I returned to work nearly 3 months ago. We knew that childcare would be expensive but holy heck! The expense feels all the more challenging because my brother and his family live in Quebec any pay only $15.50/day for two children in care versus my family’s $76/day fees. Despite a solid marriage, the blow to our discretionary income after paying for daycare causes stress for me and my husband.

I am glad to see articles like this one. One can only hope that the ideas addressed will prompt some sort of change. Let me hope.

By: “Poor cities, expensive day care” | PhD in Parenting

“Poor cities, expensive day care” | PhD in Parenting — Sat, 22 May 2010 21:08:05 +0000

[...] pay for day care for other people’s children. This came up as an issue when I wrote about the plans to offer full day junior and senior kindergarten in Ontario. I must admit I don’t fully understand why people arbitrarily think it is okay for taxpayers [...]

By: Candace

Candace — Sat, 12 Sep 2009 03:42:16 +0000

You spoke of investing in early education.

If it is just day care, then the question is what is the “public good” in this case?

In many cases, at least in the US, the parents would still not be home at the end of that day so the child would still have to be shipped back and forth.

By: phdinparenting

phdinparenting — Sat, 12 Sep 2009 03:36:43 +0000

Looks like I reached the limit in terms of threading. That was supposed to be a reply to Candace’s comment in reply to my comment above.

By: phdinparenting

phdinparenting — Sat, 12 Sep 2009 03:35:09 +0000

I’m not suggesting adding more schooling. As I said in the post, I think the half day kindergarten (which is basically learn by play) should stay as is, plus an optional additional half day of day care at the same location (so that kids don’t have to be shipped back and forth to a different caregiver).

By: Candace

Candace — Sat, 12 Sep 2009 03:28:02 +0000

At this level and age, the studies seem to suggest that schooling is not necessarily beneficial and may even be detrimental for most kids…the exception being at-risk kids who are better off in the (relatively) safe environment of school.

If the benefit is not necessarily there, I’m not sure it rises to a public good.

By: phdinparenting

phdinparenting — Sat, 12 Sep 2009 03:23:13 +0000

@Candace: That argument gets made with all social programs. Public health care just encourages people to be unhealthy and not take care of themselves because they don’t have to pay to see a doctor. Unemployment insurance/welfare just encourages people to be lazy and not work. And so on.

I think if there is going to be kindergarten at all, it makes sense to make full-day an option for parents. Not a requirement, but an option. I think it is healthier for our children to have them in one place for the day than to have them shipped back and forth between a babysitter and kindergarten if their parents do have to or want to work full-time. If our government is going to invest in early childhood education, I think it makes more sense to do it at this level/age, than to, for example, focus on creating more subsidized spaces for babies.

By: Candace

Candace — Sat, 12 Sep 2009 03:09:10 +0000

I think the question becomes, however, is it actually beneficial to society? Tax dollars for an adequate public education is a little different than tax dollars for full day kindergarten. Of course, an argument could be made that it allows parents to be more productive workers. Another argument could be made that it will push more parents into working full time before they wish to do so (someone has to be earning that money to pay those taxes). Just a couple of thoughts.

By: phdinparenting

phdinparenting — Sat, 12 Sep 2009 03:01:28 +0000

@Gayle: I keep meaning to come back and reply to this and finally I remembered!

There are certainly people who will complain about having their tax dollars pay for someone else’s day care. But I think the reality is that in Canada, and in most places in the world, our tax dollars are always going to pay for something that we do not need or use. I pay for other people’s employment insurance, other people’s health care, other people’s maternity leave, other people’s roads, other people’s upkeep in our prisons, etc.

We all pay for services that we do not need because they are beneficial to society.

I know you weren’t suggesting that your tax dollars shouldn’t pay for someone else’s day care, but the fact that that attitude exists at all annoys me.

/rant over

By: Dreamom

Dreamom — Tue, 08 Sep 2009 13:26:04 +0000

That is interesting, and like you the acads would be a concern for me – You make a critical point that the labour to have the adults they need is cheap, and not so in Canada or the US, where NO ONE in the classroom is unskilled. Having lived in Ontario, and knowing the spending habits of the government I would be SHOCKED if they did create an appropriate program…